UBB.threads Forums Edged Weapons The BCN Bayonet Forum 98K bayonet markings,,,need info

unmarked blade & scabbard,guard marked "BZP.Posen Nr.102.,,,thanks for all replies,,<Robert

Hello

I think BZP is for BahnschutzPolizei in Posen. Posen is now Poznan in Poland. Weapon number 102.

Regards
Alain

Could You made a detail photo of marking? thanks.Andy

hi,,,here is the marking,,,Robert

Thanks for pictures,it could be police marking too Bezirks Polizei Posen, best regards,Andy

thanks for the info guys,,,Robert

I ACTUALLY POSTED PICS OF ONE JUST LIKE YOURS. THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I SEE SOMEONE ELSE WITH THIS BAYONET

The S84/98 bayonet that Johnny posted is shown here.

http://phpstack-500133-1583587.cloudwaysapps.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=285265#Post285265

Notice that this bayonet has a scrubbed blade that was originally an S code that was K dated. Robert, could we see a closeup picture of the reverse ricasso of your bayonet to see if it is like Johnny's?

Andy, what do you think of the bayonet that Johnny posted? I find the markings a bit odd.

Yes You have right on it, the pommel looks without stamping so it could be a older S/xxK piece that goes not through army control and later was used by BZP, anyway i would look for marking under grips same as the push button was probably replaced and the grips are later replacement. The blade was polished postwar probably so finish is gone. The scabbard is probably not correct with a new black paint.

I took the grips off and there is a 4 digit serial and the letter "K". The scabbard looks like a Commercial scabbard, there is definitely no inspection makings on it. I don't think the scabbard has been re- painted. It has an old paint job on it like you would find on a dress bayonet.

I found another BZP Bayonet posted at the k98 forum. Here is the link for those who have an account.

http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php?8611-Polizei-Unit-Marked-S84-98&highlight=BZP+POSEN

Here are also the pics for those who don't have an account.

The 4 digits on tang should probably matched the locking nut by pressing should be visible assembly numbers, the grips are unmarked? the flashguard and grips should be normally too serialed, interesting that all of the samples has a blank blade, the bluein was probably removed, Your scabbard is serialed 2550 which dont corespond with any serials on bayonet, anyway You need look to backside, maybe there is maker stamp, anyway a black paint is not typical for a BZP piece.Maybe later added.

This last bayonet also started out life as a military bayonet made in 1940. Clearly this group of S84/98 were not made as part of a railway contract like the others we have seen since they were manufactured between 1934 and 1940. I also find it hard to believe that bayonets with these applied markings and three digit weapon number range would stretch over a six year manufacturing period. I am afraid that I am a bit skeptical of these bayonets.

I don't think that the three digit serial has anything to do with the six year period seen between the bayonets that we have observed. I don't really think they were manufactured throughout a six year period, but most likely made shortly after they occupied Poland in 1939. Probably made in 1940 from refurbished Ex-Military bayonets for the BZP Who were now in control of a major railway line in occupied Posen.

I took the grips apart. The number on the tang is the same as on the locking nut. These are the only original numbers still left. No numbers on the grips. The scabbard was definitely painted, but looks like a commercial piece. No inspection marks or company codes or markings. I applied a light coat of thinner on the scabbard and the paint came off very, very easily. It looked like an old paint job. with one swipe the paint came off. Underneath was the original blued finish, worn in some areas, but original bluing. There was no sanding to the scabbard, looks like just a light coat of paint.

Thanks for details, as mentioned the piece was a early production i assume a Coppel GmbH piece from 1934 so probably S/173K marked,that were not going through the army inspection, and were a later used for the Police or Railway contract.The scabbard is a commerzial contract but missmatch on this bayonet, as it have a 2550 serial number. Probably a police piece, most real on WKC blanko piece pre 1939.The grips are various makers, one looks like remain of serial near one end(on 53/Z3)marked one. The push button was replaced.The locking nut is match and ok. The color of grips correspond with late 1939 early 1940 period.Anyway a nice piece.