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Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117833 04/08/2008 10:15 PM Joined: Mar 2002 Posts: 6,304 Canada P patrice patrice P Joined: Mar 2002 Posts: 6,304 Canada Excellent thread and vey informative. These fakes are becoming better and better but are still light years away from any original.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117834 04/09/2008 10:46 AM Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 35 South Carolina A Alfred B. Alfred B. A Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 35 South Carolina A Big "Thank You" from me too. This is the kind of information I visit this forum for. Great pictures and information. Very good job. This is great information for all. Best Regards, Al

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117835 04/09/2008 01:32 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast We will see more of these, you can be certain. Someone spent some big money tooling up to make those components and they will make more than one! The blade is the correct length, width, depth and weight. The steel is a duller color than the real ones. You should expect to see these in SA and NSKK too. The basic indicators are: - Grip wood too perfect - incorrect tang nut - RZM style plated scabbard fittings and screws - Very light scabbard Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117836 04/15/2008 12:30 AM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast There is one point that I missed in the above thread, so let's see who can find it. There is one fairly obvious point that says this is NOT an Eickhorn dagger. Anyone ? Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117837 04/15/2008 04:08 AM Joined: Mar 2001 Posts: 667 northeastern eagles nest, #01... Paul Horton Paul Horton Joined: Mar 2001 Posts: 667 northeastern eagles nest, #01... Dave, I thank you for this thread, this alone is a great example of what this forum is all about, without knowledge like this available, alot of guys would get burnt. thanks for your time, and effort! (lets hope the "BAD GUYS" dont see this thread, and make adjustments accordingly!) lol, as far as being able to tell what makes this not a Eickhorn, I have no clue, and I am anxiously awaiting the answer! "Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a mans character, give him power" Abraham Lincoln

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117838 04/15/2008 06:01 AM Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 831 North of Norway Trigger Trigger Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 831 North of Norway Dave, I dont know if you refer to the motto, but some letters are definately not matching an early Eickhorn motto. M and h for example, but also other letters are somewhat different. Best regards, Tor-Helge

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117839 04/15/2008 12:56 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Not the motto, although that is not a good copy either. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117840 04/15/2008 10:18 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast It's not a subtle or hidden point - It is right in front of you Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117841 04/15/2008 11:17 PM Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,436 New Zealand Ruski Ruski Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,436 New Zealand The eye on the maker mark looks very low! Regards Russell

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117842 04/16/2008 12:51 AM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast No .... Look at the last picture I posted Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117843 04/16/2008 04:34 AM Joined: Aug 2001 Posts: 86 North Carolina USA M Matt Matt M Joined: Aug 2001 Posts: 86 North Carolina USA Once again Dave has provided an in depth study of the SS Dagger Thanks Dave Matt

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117844 04/16/2008 07:03 AM Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Redbaron Redbaron Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa The hand accented grooves on the crossguards???

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117845 04/16/2008 01:22 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Red, Nope. Not the grooves. Those are NOT hand accented, they are casting flaws. Keep looking Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117846 04/16/2008 02:22 PM Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Redbaron Redbaron Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa I meant the hand accenting to the grooves we see on early Eick crossguards aren't on these... OK, how about that they're not HE or AR internally marked???

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117847 04/16/2008 02:47 PM Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Redbaron Redbaron Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Wait, what about no GAU stamp?

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117848 04/16/2008 02:51 PM Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Redbaron Redbaron Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 915 Johannesburg, South Africa Darn, I meant District stamp!

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117849 04/16/2008 07:07 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Nope. Nope.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117850 04/16/2008 07:39 PM Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 2,615 Likes: 1 Gold Country S Serge (aka Wagner) Serge (aka Wagner) S Joined: Jul 2006 Posts: 2,615 Likes: 1 Gold Country Dave, All I can see is the scabbard throat is "thin" and not the Eickhorn "thick" type. -serge-

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117851 04/16/2008 08:28 PM Joined: Feb 2001 Posts: 288 Likes: 1 Illinois Nietzsche Nietzsche Joined: Feb 2001 Posts: 288 Likes: 1 Illinois Early Eickhorn crossguards should be marked "H,E" or "A,R". 1 member likes this: ollar

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117852 04/16/2008 09:20 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Yes ! I looked at it a long time before the penny dropped. Eickhorn did not use P.A. guards. Serge, Also correct. Anybody else spot something I missed ? Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117853 04/18/2008 01:16 PM Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 71 MN P P-35 P-35 P Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 71 MN Is the ebony handle the same lenght and width as the originals? I bet the dark finish on the handle is appiled staining?

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117854 04/18/2008 01:37 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Yes, the grip was the correct width, height, and within the correct weight range. It was not ebony. Vern looked at it and guessed dyed pear wood. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117855 04/18/2008 03:00 PM Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 71 MN P P-35 P-35 P Joined: Feb 2007 Posts: 71 MN Thanks Dave great thread.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117856 02/12/2010 11:07 AM Joined: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,717 Likes: 2 Philadelphia Larry C Larry C Joined: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,717 Likes: 2 Philadelphia quote: Paul H Posted 15 April 2008 01:08 Hide Post Dave, I thank you for this thread, this alone is a great example of what this forum is all about, without knowledge like this available, alot of guys would get burnt. thanks for your time, and effort! (lets hope the "BAD GUYS" dont see this thread, and make adjustments accordingly!) Paul is absolutely right we hope that they dont see it, but like vultures they are watching as we write and post. It is up to "us" to carry on this great hobby, so that deception does not takeover and lie to the new collector. This is some scary stuff, Dave posted. "Deine, Ehre Heisst Treue" Your honor is your loyalty to this hobby. Lets stay ahead of these guys. Good job again Dave. Sincere Thanks Larry Historical Stewardship is a Trusted Honor that must be kept!

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117857 02/25/2010 07:49 PM Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 157 Mikatim Mikatim Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 157 Thanks Dave, great thread with verry good pictures. Ralf My homepage: www.dienstdolch.de

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117858 02/25/2010 08:05 PM Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 157 Mikatim Mikatim Joined: Apr 2007 Posts: 157 Hello Dave, I have try to you a private message to send. That cannot be done!!! Can you write me down please times? ralfzx7r@web.de Greeting Ralf My homepage: www.dienstdolch.de

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117859 02/25/2010 10:34 PM Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 87 maryland R Rbt Lee Stevens Rbt Lee Stevens R Joined: Feb 2009 Posts: 87 maryland Thanks for sharing your knowledge.Certainly makes the hobby more enjoyable for those of us who still have a lot to learn!

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117860 02/25/2010 11:54 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Mik, I don't use PM. Send email to dave@germandaggers.com One of the guys who recently showed a fake one here was going to send it to me so I could photo it, but I have not heard from him. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger #117861 05/31/2010 04:06 PM Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 200 Bayonne, NJ M Mark Giannullo Mark Giannullo M Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 200 Bayonne, NJ Hi Dave, GREAT article! Although I no longer have my SS daggers, I am ALWAYS open to learning. You just never know when the next one will come your way. I wouldn't want to,as the book says Get stuck by a Phoney Dagger". Thanks again. Peace, Mark

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Mark Giannullo #221812 06/29/2010 11:42 PM Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 119 USA forton forton Joined: Apr 2009 Posts: 119 USA Thanks for the Imformation, as the prices for original SS & SA daggers get higher the fakes get better.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger forton #221836 06/30/2010 01:51 AM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast If you have phony SS daggers or ones that have been ... um ... humped, consider posting them here. Or send them to me and I'll post. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Dave #221885 06/30/2010 11:14 AM Joined: May 2009 Posts: 47 Pretoria, South Africa F.Smuts F.Smuts Joined: May 2009 Posts: 47 Pretoria, South Africa Dave thanks for the informative post! As a new collector this is information surely helps a lot! One question, when you have it in hand was it easy to spot it was a fake? Did you know right away or did you have to spend some time going over the nitty gritties so to speak? I think a dagger like this would probably be photographed in such a way to hide the flaws, put on an auction site like ebay and then sent to the unsuspecting seller.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger F.Smuts #221900 06/30/2010 03:58 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Even from a distance it looked too pretty. I spotted the new looking grip wood right away. Then the trademark positioning as soon as I saw the blade. After that I saw signs as noted above. A new guy would probably not spot these. With the value of these daggers, there is a big incentive to fake them. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Dave #229542 10/05/2010 08:31 PM Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 4 OR. USA Haen Haen Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 4 OR. USA THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU !!! I have a(poor)repro dagger with chain. As an old W.SS vet (34th) I just look at it for nostalgia's sake. Just from reading this ONE thread i learned a lot. I am not a collector, but am very interested looking at the schemes people will go through to make a fast buck. The scary part is that replicas are getting better and better, and I wonder how many will be taken for a ride. As always: Caveat emptor ! Haen when an elephant flies, don't criticise his style; just marvel that he does it.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Haen #238453 01/31/2011 03:31 AM Joined: Nov 2009 Posts: 51 N NOTTANATZI NOTTANATZI N Joined: Nov 2009 Posts: 51 Dave, That must have taken you a considerable amount of time to post. I'm just another member saying Thank You.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger NOTTANATZI #238468 01/31/2011 04:55 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Thanks US collectors - If you have a fake and send it to me, I will do a thread on it and return it. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Dave #254375 11/05/2011 11:41 PM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast A reminder that if you have a fake and live in the US**, please send it to me for posting and analysis. I'll keep you name out of it if you wish and sent it back at my expense. I'd buy it too, for $100 or less. ** other areas too, if your local Customs won't get too exited

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Dave #254815 11/23/2011 02:16 AM Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 4 OR. USA Haen Haen Joined: Sep 2009 Posts: 4 OR. USA How about one from BUDK knives, from ten meter distance they look OK . Thy cost $ 12.99 plus shipping. If you will pay $100.00 for it (LOL) I will buy a couple of dozen, and send them to you. (LOL-LOL) Just kidding. !!!!! Thanks for the postings guys, never too old to learn, even at 85 HN when an elephant flies, don't criticise his style; just marvel that he does it.

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Haen #254883 11/24/2011 01:00 AM Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Dave OP OP Dave Joined: Sep 2000 Posts: 15,094 Likes: 99 Southeast Those $12.95 or even $21.95 don't fool anyone. I am very interested in doing "show & tell" on the newer fakes that can really confuse newer collectors. Dave

Re: The Anatomy of ANOTHER Fake SS Dagger Dave #293549 01/07/2014 05:37 PM Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 950 N.Y. D Dutchman Dutchman D Joined: Apr 2004 Posts: 950 N.Y. Hi Dave,I may have one for you.How can I contact you for the pix? Thanks Dutchman. "Alles Fur Deutschland"